B-Schooled Podcast Episode #294: A Reapplicant’s Stanford Comeback

This transcript has been lightly edited for clarity and length. Timestamps refer to the audio.

SBC Consultant Alex: Hi. So, today we’re being joined by a former client and a Stanford grad, Ty Greenberg. Ty has a very unique background that I think will be interesting to our listeners. He’s also a successful re-applicant who did something that I know many of our listeners try to do: if denied at first by the schools of their choice, persist and get in. Ty, welcome to the podcast.

Ty Greenberg (0:35): Thanks, Alex. It’s good to be here. It’s good to see you again.

Alex: And yes, good to be with you. Excited to be here. So the first thing I want to ask you is to describe your background and what you did before you decided to apply to an MBA.

Ty: Yeah, yeah. So, I have a somewhat non-traditional background, as you were saying, for applying to business school. So, I applied back in 2021.

In terms of my career, I was a graduate from Georgetown with the School of Foreign Service. I actually started my career at a law firm, a litigation firm based out of New York. I started my career as an analyst.

I did two years as an analyst. It was a really weird role. So, for this particular firm, they didn’t have paralegals. They didn’t have associates. So, you were sort of framed as the master of the facts. So, kind of an untraditional start to my career.

And then I ended up staying another two years doing a bunch of business and operations and building programs within this law firm. So, I think when I was applying back then, I was trying to figure out sort of how I could stand out to the admissions committee. I wasn’t sure if I wanted to apply to business schools.

I was also applying to law school. So, I was just trying to sort out really where I can stand out and what were the best paths for me. And so, yeah, I think for me, the transition to business school was kind of a gradual process.

But I always knew I wanted to go to Stanford. And that was kind of my dream at the time. So, I just really wanted to make that happen.

Alex (2:06): So, can you tell us which schools did you apply to and what happened?

Ty: Yeah. So, you know, I had this dream to go to Stanford, but I applied to a mix of business schools and actually law schools in the first cycle. So, yeah, I knew that I had this kind of career in the legal profession.

And so, I kind of knew what a career path. And I had some specific goals that I would want to pursue if I went to law school. On the business school path, I had kind of found out through really the work that I did at this law firm that I actually loved entrepreneurship.

I love building programs. And so, I applied to a mix of all sorts of top business schools: Harvard, Stanford, Wharton, MIT, pretty much all the M7 schools. So, I wasn’t too selective, to be transparent, at the time.

I was just thinking that business school would be a way for me to kind of pivot and elevate my career. And I thought it’d be a great place to get a new network. I was interested in pursuing stuff in the legal tech side, doing some stuff on FinTech.

And so that was really back in 2021 kind of what I was thinking. And those were types of schools that I was looking at.

Alex (3:18): What was your story in terms of your vision? What did you tell me you wanted to do, short- or long-term? How did you frame that?

Ty: Yeah, I mean, it was a gradual process. And I think this is something where Alex, you were really helpful. It’s kind of drawing out that narrative. I think one of the things I really wanted to do was have impact.

I wanted to build a new program. I knew that I was entrepreneurial. I knew I loved startups.

And I was trying to find something kind of intersection of that. And I thought Stanford in particular, but a lot of business schools would have served as a platform to kind of pivot into that ecosystem. I thought that the sort of opportunity set versus legal services was much broader.

And I was trying to find sort of that unity in that path. I think for me, it was a gradual transition through my career. I never thought I’d end up at Georgetown for undergrad.

I never really thought I’d end up at a law firm. So, there were all these different sort of random inflection points where, for one reason or another, I opted into a different sort of trajectory. So, when I was at Georgetown, I just really wanted to actually be a foreign service officer.

That’s why I came to the School of Foreign Service. And then when I was graduating, actually, there was a hiring freeze with Trump. So foreign service was just totally, totally out of the realm of possibility.

I ended up working at this law firm because they were basically, “Oh, hey, you can just do a lot of international client work and travel, and you can get that international exposure.” I actually had not that much interest in legal services. I just kind of was interested in doing something international, working with people from other countries, and learning more about the US legal system as well.

And then, you know, that totally was very different. But it kind of pulled me along that trajectory. And then I found out I was an entrepreneur.

So, you kind of get pulled along these things. And I think it’s hard to find coherency sometimes. But I think what you and I worked on in terms of, how do you pull out that thread across those different inflection points? And then, how do you present that in a coherent way for an admissions committee?

And then how do you also explain what you want to do next when, as a practical matter, you might not know, you just have a sense of the different interests and context where you’d excel.

I think that was kind of the process. And I don’t know if it’s a universal process for everyone. But that’s kind of the work that you have to do.

Alex (5:43): So, you applied to all these schools. Tell us about the results.

Ty: Yeah. I was actually waitlisted at Stanford, which I was super excited about. But it kind of put me in an interesting position because I was like, OK, I mean, I went on the waitlist for the school of my dreams first round, but I didn’t know if I got in. And then literally everywhere else, I was either rejected or waitlisted.

I always joke with my friends that I was like the LeBron James of waitlists. So, I kind of had this crippling anxiety for almost a year where I wasn’t sure if I could get into Stanford. I wasn’t sure if I was going to leave.

I was living in D.C. at that time. So, I don’t know if I’m going to move to the West Coast. I might get in. I might not. I just really didn’t know exactly what I was doing.

Even people I worked with at the firm at the time are asking, Are you going to business school? And I was like, Potentially; I don’t know. I’m trying to figure it out. So, I’m on the waitlist. I think that’s encouraging.

But yeah, it was a mix of results. And then ultimately, I didn’t get off the waitlist. I wasn’t successful really getting in anywhere.

And it was the weirdest experience because I think I’m competitive. I think I’ve put together a really great application working with you and working with Stacy Blackman. But yeah, ultimately didn’t have that result.

So, it was like, do I reapply? Do I do something different? And so, yeah, happy to talk through what I did and why I reapplied. But that was kind of the result of the initial foray.

Alex: You stayed on the Stanford waitlist till the very end, right?

Ty (7:15):  Yeah, so I did. We worked on this a lot, but I submitted updates every cycle. I continued to progress things in my career. I got promoted. I had other opportunities that I was pursuing. I wrote a ton of letters actually to the admissions committee.

I don’t know if they ever formally read it, but I was like, hey, I’ve learned all these legal advocacy skills in the context of working at the software. Why don’t I apply to try to sort of get me off the waitlist? And so every opportunity that I had, by the way, I don’t know if they ever read those. I would just get an email like: we’ve looked at it and we’re adding it to your file.

But I think I kind of transitioned my mindset to like, OK, this is an ongoing relationship with this particular business school, but also just generally through my application process. This is a conversation. And so, I’m just going to keep them posted on every progress point.

And I’m going to continue to make meaningful steps in my career and in what I was doing in my professional life. So that’s kind of my approach. I don’t recommend it for everybody, but that’s what I did practically.

Alex (8:25): You built a relationship with them and ultimately didn’t work out. You know, you did something that very few people get to do.

You got an interview with GSB and almost get in. Very disappointing. You didn’t despair when it didn’t work out. Tell us what you did next in that year before you eventually reapplied.

Ty: Yeah. Well, so it was a mix of things. I just wasn’t sure if I’d ever get into business school. And I was not getting anywhere, not just Stanford. I was just not able to find any traction. I learned about this in business school, where there are, like, product markets. I had no product market fit.

So, I was just kind of stalled. I just figured it was a weird year. I mean, this was 2021.

It was the middle of the pandemic. There was actually an influx of applications to business schools. And there was a bunch of people that decided to delay going because they didn’t want to do a different type of business school experience.

I figured it was just statistically a little bit of an unusual year and I was competitive. I had confidence in my skill set and the profile that I put together and work with you on, an admissions package.

So, I ended up taking a new job, which was something that I had talked about in my app. I wanted to go to the West Coast. So, I moved out to the West Coast. I took a new job as a director at a litigation finance fund, which was a startup. But it was super fun.

I had told the admissions committee I was interested in the startup ecosystem. So, I sort of credibly leaned into that. I re-did the test. I thought a weakness was actually my test scores. So, I retook it and bumped up my score just a little bit, which I thought was helpful. I ended up actually changing the set of folks that wrote on my behalf.

I found other people that I think were more close to what I was doing at that time. And I just reapplied. I actually stopped applying to law schools. I was like, that’s not really what I want.

And I just applied to the three business schools that I thought would be really exciting. And I had made a ton of progress in my career.

Alex (10:42): So basically, you address what we analyze in terms of the weaknesses. You have no experience in entrepreneurship. You made the big leap. Nice bump in title. You went to a director level and you moved to the West Coast. So, I think the key lesson here for reapplicants is to make changes.

Don’t expect to sort of achieve different results with the same story. You really went out there, analyzed what the weak points were, and you made some drastic changes.

Ty: Yeah. Yeah. And I think, through that process of being on the waitlist, I had an opportunity to really reflect. So, when I applied, I also changed my story slightly, and I refined it.

You are the same core person. So, there was sort of a sharpening process where I was like, here are the things that really matter to me.

Here’s what I’m working on. Here are the steps that I’ve taken that get me closer to that objective. And here’s how business school fits into that.

But, this is me, and this is who I am. And I really got super crystal clear on that. And so I think actually it was one of the best things in retrospect that ever happened to me because it really forced me to get super disciplined in terms of, to your point.

What are your weaknesses? How can I practically improve those? What are my strengths? How do I draw those out and emphasize them as much as possible? I mean, you do this, and I’m an entrepreneur now. I run a startup, and I do this process over and over again in a business context. What are my weaknesses? Work on my weaknesses.

What are my strengths? Accentuate my strengths. How do I sell this effectively? What’s my narrative? How do I communicate? How do I tell that story? So that was a great process, actually. And I think it’s a funny thing.

The first thing you do before you get to business school is you have to sell yourself to an admissions committee. And I think it’s actually a good skill and process to run through both personally, but also professionally, just to kind of have to think through that. And you were a great advisor in that. Yeah.

Alex (12:34): You stay engaged with the committee throughout. You build a relationship. You made some drastic changes. So, tell us how long before you reapplied again, how much time passed in between and which schools did you reapply to?

Ty: Yeah, so I only applied to MIT, Harvard, and Stanford; a full year had passed. But because I had been on the waitlist and I had applied round one, I was submitting stuff every quarter. So, I think I actually heard back in August or late in the summer that I wasn’t in.

And I basically resubmitted a week later. But I knew that I was interested in reapplying, and I hadn’t made a ton of steps in my career. So, at that point, I felt if I get in, that’s great. I definitely want to pursue this. But if not, I felt pretty confident in my trajectory. And I had made a lot of the changes that I had been talking about in my application.

So I think that’s something that’s also kind of funny about business school is that it kind of comes to you sometimes when you least expect it. Or, you’re sort of actually maybe thinking, oh, I’m not sure if I need this. And then if you feel like, oh, this is actually the experience that I could use. And for these reasons, you can definitely go and do it.

It’s definitely a unique experience these days.

Alex (14:00): So, you reapplied to those three schools. Tell us about the results.

Ty: Yeah. So actually I ended up getting into all three, which was great, super exciting, and very validating. And then I just decided I still wanted to go to Stanford.

That was my dream. And so I just went there. But I think, yeah, it was a total reversal of the experience.

But end to end, the whole process, probably from deciding that I wanted to go to business school, starting to work with Stacy Blackman, and then actually getting in, was a two-and-a-half-year journey. So definitely not for the faint of heart, but I was persistent and gritty. And I think I executed it on what I was trying to do.

Alex: I have to say this is one of the most amazing stories I’ve dealt with to go from all rejections to getting top three schools in the country. I mean, it’s extremely rare to get into both Stanford and Harvard. I can tell you, I have clients who get into one, but not the other.

Yeah. It’s something that’s extremely rare. So it was really, really incredible turnaround.

It was really amazing. Tell us more about the work with Stacy Blackman, maybe your reflections on what was good, what was helpful ultimately, and sort of how you felt about that process.

Ty (15:30): Well, I mean, look, it was a long relationship, and it was a process. So you and I worked together pretty intensively. We had a lot of late nights. One of the things that I thought, working with Stacy Blackman and working with you, it was really helpful with building up that foundation of that process to think through your career and all these different inflection points.

And I think almost psychologically getting myself in a place where I was like, OK, I have this non-traditional profile. But what are the things that make me exceptional? How can I draw those out? Where’s the coherency across all these experiences?

So, I think where you guys were really great advisors was helping me build that muscle up and develop that narrative. And I think finding that story is really useful and a good exercise to run through at any stage of your career, whether you’re post-business school. I still use that same skill set.

I think another piece is the flight test. So, you get the benefit of having sort of someone really kick the tires on your application and figure out what are those strengths and what are those weaknesses. And then you can kind of simulate in real time how the admissions office or the admissions committee would think about you as an applicant.

And that’s another really valuable thing in any context. So, when I raise VC money now, I’ll go to friends who are VCs, give them my pitch, and then they’ll say, “OK, here are the strengths of your company.” Here’s the weaknesses. Here’s what we like, what we don’t like. So, I think being super accepting of feedback is a good skill. Starting to lean on other people.

Alex (16:59): Listeners who are not familiar with the concept of flight test, it’s basically Stacy Blackman has former AdComs from all the top schools who will review your application right before submission with all the elements completed. They do it in a way that’s an actual AdCom review and provide feedback on various aspects for consistency, quality, and any other feedback. And that’s kind of the gist of the flight test.

Ty: And I think just working with you and getting to understand a little bit more about sort of like across different sort of classes of folks that apply to business school.

What are some common things that help you pop as an applicant? What are some things that are potential weaknesses? Just understanding how admissions committees think about applicants. How should you think about your story and your narrative?

I think going to business school is a very unique and privileged opportunity. But the admissions process is long, and it’s a process. And so I think having someone who’s really good with that and understanding the scene and across multiple cycles is very valuable.

So that I think that was one of the best. I mean, it was a partnership, you know. We collaborated.

Alex (18:17): That’s great. Thank you for that. So amazing story. Two and a half year journey. Complete rejection across several schools to changing things drastically to getting into the very best schools that everyone dreams about. Amazing story.

In parting, any sort of closing thoughts now that you’ve graduated, you’ve gone through the whole process, you’re a Stanford grad? Any thoughts for the listeners out there who are thinking about business schools and their careers and so on?

Ty: Yeah, I mean, I think my story is one where hustle and grit were really important for me.

So, I think if you’re someone who’s on the waitlist, I would say don’t despair. You have a competitive profile, have confidence in that and go forward. A lot of people in your career and in life will tell you no.

And I think, in some instances, it’s good to hear “no” and do something else. But in other instances, if you think you’re on to something and you feel like you have a competitive edge or you feel like you have a right to win, I would just go after it.

I would be confident that and I would work with smart people, like Alex. You’re amazing to work with. And Stacy Blackman was super amazing.

But find those people around you that can support you and elevate you in that journey. But definitely don’t give up. So that’d be my kind of narrative.

And I would be smart about it. I would figure out as we talked about your strengths and your weaknesses, make real improvements, make changes. Use the data that’s coming out to you, coming at you from the world strategically; don’t just ignore that stuff.

If someone’s saying, hey, this is something you can improve, gravitate towards that. But definitely stay true to yourself and be authentic. And maybe it’s a lot of platitudes, but I think, hang in there.

And there are other people that have experiences where they fail and then they’re able to kind of come back from it. So, I think that’s my core narrative, and that’s what I would recommend to folks.

Alex (20:22): Thank you very much. It was a pleasure seeing you again. And thank you for sharing. This was incredibly valuable.